The Great Global Warming Swindle

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Nemesis6, Mar 13, 2007.

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  1. Nemesis6

    Nemesis6 Newbie

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    http://video.google.com/url?docid=-...windle&usg=AL29H22bAjPH6m8oC1tuRfGxhJ4Vtl_OTw

    Produced by UK4(I think?), the movie goes on to illustrate how global warming is bullshit and how those who the theory of it threatened to silence through ostracization and actual death threats. Essentially, it's junk science. I hadn't taken a position on this before this, but this pretty much convinced me that it was bullshit. What about you?
     
  2. 99.vikram

    99.vikram Tank

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    For the time being I'll play safe and assume it's real. This video gave little in the way of hard facts, so I dont buy it.
    (I'm not saying it is DEFINITELY real)
     
  3. Mechagodzilla

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    The video is temporarily offline for whatever reason.

    Could you summarize which parts of the video convinced you, given that it is a google video listed beside google videos saying the war on terror is a conspiracy and the kennedy assassination is a conspiracy and 9/11 is a conspiracy? :p

    Burden of proof, man; I call bullshit. On a Nemesis post.

    What else is new?
     
  4. ComradeBadger

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    It was on Channel 4. It's a proper documentary :)
     
  5. Solaris

    Solaris Party Escort Bot

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  6. CyberPitz

    CyberPitz Party Escort Bot

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    Personally, I don't have a stance on Global Warming. I'll watch the video later today when I get home from work, but as of right now...I don't know.
     
  7. theotherguy

    theotherguy Newbie

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    Didn't we already have a couple of threads dedicated to this video?

    EDIT: watching the video I am appalled at how these scientists can say that "co2 certainly never drove climate change in the past" Hello?? What about the mico-ecocene maximum? That was entirely driven by Co2. In fact, it was caused by a huge field of pete being exposed by falling sea levels which then burned for several years, releasing extreme amounts of Co2 into the air and causing a massive temperature change of 8 degrees globally.
     
  8. Absinthe

    Absinthe The Freeman

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    Isn't there already a topic on this? And if so, wasn't it pretty much established that the maker of the film has a history of misleading and bullshiting both his viewers and interviewees?
     
  9. Mechagodzilla

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    The fact that it was actually broadcast doesn't mean it's any more valid than the average clarkyism. Discovery channel inexplicably has daily prorgramming about ghosts and UFOs. Fox has done alien autopsy and moon landing hoax conspiracy documentaries.

    The question is whether the actual arguments are compelling in the face of criticism, and so far I'm getting a conspiracy theory I can't even view, seemingly based on naught but anecdotes, plus a glowing endorsement from Nemesis "your points against me are valid but- hey look it's islam distraction! Yoink!" Six.

    So the bullshit call stands.

    Also, the Absinthe revelation is TOTALLY UNSURPRISING.

    So now the question is whether the thread gets closed for breaking the rule against conspiracy theory google video bullpap. Any reason to keep this open?
     
  10. DaMaN

    DaMaN Newbie

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    Nope.

    But I'm going to argue my point anyways ;)

    I mean, it's been established for over a hundred years that CO2 and other greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere cause the Earth to be warm. If it didn't, the Earth's temperature would be a whole lot lower and humans would have never evolved. This is caused the greenhouse effect.

    It's also been scientifically established that there are more greenhouse gasses in the air now than there has been for a long time.

    And finally, according to the IPCC, "Most of the observed increase in globally averaged temperatures since the mid-20th century is very likely (greater than 90% likely) due to the observed increase in anthropogenic (human) greenhouse gas concentrations".


    So unless someone is willing to provide evidence that...
    A) Greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere do not warm the Earth,
    B) Recently there have not been large greenhouse gas emissions
    or
    C) Recent large greenhouse gas emissions are not caused by humans
    ...then there's not much else that can be discussed here.
     
  11. Sulkdodds

    Sulkdodds Companion Cube

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    I have not watched the documentary so can't really comment, but this link and this one would appear to be pertinent.

    I would also say the thread shouldn't be closed as it is hosted by a major, generally respectable broadcasting company, albeit one which has said of the program: "It is essentially a polemic and we are expecting it to cause trouble."

    If there are flaws in the argument of the film, or reasons to distrust it inherent in its conception, then they should be revealed in this thread rather than left to independent investigation after a hasty closure.
     
  12. DaMaN

    DaMaN Newbie

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    Hmm... I see your point Sulkdodds. I guess we should keep it open then...
     
  13. Direwolf

    Direwolf Newbie

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    As far as I can tell the reason that we keep seeing people on both sides of the debate citing stuff about how information is being suppressed is that it really does happen occasionally. But just because someone is unfairly trying to stop someone from publishing something doesn't mean that what they're publishing is the truth.
     
  14. SAJ

    SAJ Newbie

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    I could go on for hours about how much bullshit was in this so-called "documentary" , but to save time and space I will let George Monbiot do the work as he has deconstructed the program as well as one could aleady.....
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,,2032361,00.html

    Sorry, but I have to post this part again. I really is damning...
    So, in a nutshell , the film's main contention is shown to be based on an utterly disproven and discredited theory. And, what is worse is that the filmmaker himself was quite aware of that fact, and chose not to inform the audience

    Pretty much says it all, the commisioning editors can only have been motivated by profits for Channel four, as they were well aware that the filmmaker (who had produced films for them before) had a dodgy past to say the least.*


    Here is his letter of complaint, its long but I have highlighted the parts that will make the points...
    Its a shame that there will be plenty of people (as the OP has shown) who are stupid enough to be taken in by this garbage masquerading as information.


    * Durkin, made a film for channel four which equated the green movement to nazi's. So many complaints about selective editing and misrepresentation of interviewees viewpoints were made, that Channel four were forced into making a public apology.
     
  15. Nemesis6

    Nemesis6 Newbie

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    Sorry but, weren't the IPCC the ones who themselves cut and pasted the parts they liked from scientists, and essentially ignored all points they didn't?

    But I think this issue can be summed up like this when it comes to the social norm -

    Kid - "Excuse me, my dad's a geologist, and he says there's no such thing as global warming."
    Environmentalists, pushing the kids to prepare for "Earth Day" - "That's not true <does the Jedi mind trick thing with his hand> Global warming is going to kill us all."

    The guys in the video said it: If you go against the current, as some might see this post as - You will be ostracized, and you will most likely not get any funding for ideas that prove the opposite of what the environmentalists say about global warming. For example, as one guy said - Do a report on the squirrels' nut-collecting in Sussex and guess how much funding you'll get for that. But involve global warming, and it's another story.
     
  16. SAJ

    SAJ Newbie

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    An assertion made in the film does not (as demonstrated) equal a fact.
    I could say that in a hundred years the moon will turn to cheese, who can prove me wrong? No-one, doesnt make a fantasy into a fact though.




    Yeah, its all jedi mind tricks, uh-huh :rolling:
    See point one.
     
  17. Sulkdodds

    Sulkdodds Companion Cube

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    Source?

    Congratulations, this bears no relation to reality and says nothing meaningful. It's not even funny.

    I don't buy it. The fact that this documentary even exists and is so widely accepted as credible (regardless of its truthfulness) is indicative of widespread disagreement regarding global warming. To use anecdotal evidence: I and almost everyone I know have found it very difficult to get an overview of the subject because of the mass of conflicting opinions, many of which are utter and complete bullshit and/or clearly biased.

    Any "ostrasizing" going on in this thread appears to be based on the percieved failure of the film's argument.

    The example of squirrels collecting nuts also bears little relevance to the matter of hand - that is something which has nothing to do with global warming, rather than something which attempts to contradict the villanous green fascists.

    People like SAJ are providing detailed and credible sources.

    You are providing trite examples and unsourced statements.

    I'd like to remain neutral here as I haven't seen the documentary nor made my own detailed foray into the evidence, but quite frankly you're making it impossible.
     
  18. CptStern

    CptStern suckmonkey

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    thanks SAJ for clarifying the issue ..most informative. Oh and Nemesis you really do have a tendecy to jump on a bandwagon ..especially if it's contrary to "liberal moonbat thinkspeak"
     
  19. Candy art

    Candy art Newbie

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    what am I supposed to believe now lol?
    TV says it's true..and other TV stations say its not true.


    I'm so confused
     
  20. Absinthe

    Absinthe The Freeman

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    You won't be ostracized for going against the current.

    You'll be ostracized for being an idiot.
     
  21. Sulkdodds

    Sulkdodds Companion Cube

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    Not man-made? THIS IS ENVIRO-SPARTAAA!

    *kicks Nemesis into pit*
     
  22. CptStern

    CptStern suckmonkey

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    lol that made me ...lol
     
  23. SAJ

    SAJ Newbie

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    You have the internet at your disposal, and(one assumes) a brain with which to utilise it.

    You figure it out.

    I dont take any of the credit for the rebuttal posted above, all of the work was done by the journalist George Monbiot.
    I just quoted from his article as the alternative was hours of back tracking to find sources for everything.
    If I get the time I will find more.

    Here's some background on the programme's contributors(curtesy of.. http://www.climatedenial.org/ )


    Already mentioned was Carl Wunsch
    For the time being I would like to say this; If you are uncertain as to what to think about man-made global warming,(for whater reason) educate yourself.
    Its not an ideological debate, it's a scientific one, the facts are out there -at your disposal- use them.

    All you need to get a hold of the issue is a (very)basic understanding of chemistry and physics, and of course a desire to know something rather than be told something.
     
  24. ComradeBadger

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  25. KagePrototype

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